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Nathan Ashe - He just about scrapes onto this list by playing 5 games this season. Unfortunately for him, I think most Saints fans will agree when I say that all 5 were extremely underwhelming. To be fair to him though, I don't think he can take 100% of the blame really. He is obviously inexperienced at Super League level and was thrown in at Stand-Off right in the middle of an injury crisis. He just doesn't have the ability needed to play at this level in my opinion. I suspect his days at LP are numbered.

PAUL CLOUGH - He seems to be on the fringes of the team these days and hasn't really progressed from the potential he was showing a couple of years ago. He always seemed to have something extra to his game in the sense that he had the ability to twist and turn in the tackle in order to make those extra yards, but these days he is basically decent workhorse and little else. He wont let you down, but given the recruitment up front ahead of next season he is far from first choice. I'd love him to kick on next season if given the opportunity, but he still has a lot to prove.

MARK FLANAGAN - Before his injury at Hull KR, I was quietly impressed with him. Solid defensively, makes decent metres with the ball and can be used as a ball player if needed. I don't think he necessarily gets the credit he deserves, but that could be because we have so many back rowers who offer practically the same skill set. Next year is a big one for him.

ADE GARDNER - Another injury hit season for him and most were surprised to see him being offered a new deal. He does a job in the sense that he is decent defensively and works hard but he doesn't really have the pace, or carry the attacking threat that you need these days. Any opportunities from short range he is capable of finishing though. He won't be first choice next year, but his experience isn't a bad thing I suppose.

JOE GREENWOOD -Not a world beater, but he's done himself proud this year. He's a big strong lad with a decent bit of pace and can break a tackle. As the game against Wigan showed, he doesn't lack confidence. Again though, hopefully the signings made wont halt or alter his progress to much. He certainly has potential.

LANCE HOHAIA - I was hoping he would feel the need to prove a point this year but I find myself saying the same things again. He just isn't a Stand-Off. Certainly not a Stand-Off capable of directing the side without a Scrum-Half. To his credit though, he improved as the season got on, and I suspect will be first choice 6 next season. If he can keep up his end of season form out side of Walsh then he could do a job, but this has to be his last chance.

STAURT HOWARTH -With James Roby missing for the majority of the year, we decided to bring in the competitions worst team's hooker to fill in as temporary first choice number 9. It didn't take us long to realise why that was. His distribution was decent enough, but that was it. I can't remember him making a break, he doesn't offer a kicking game, and he doesn't threaten out of dummy-half. He does a job in a way, but that is it. I'm not blaming him, he was totally out of his depth and did the best he could. Sums up the clubs lack of ambition for the past couple of years.

JOSH JONES - Surprisingly he has played in every game for Saints this year, and appears to be highly rated by the management. He's one of those who you don't really notice, but does the basics really well. He certainly looks much more comfortable in the second row that in the centres. His footwork is decent, he is relatively quick for a back rower, and is defensively very good. Again though, with the options available next year he won't be first choice. Will be interesting to see him progress though. Has a bright future without a doubt.

ANTHONY LAFFRANCHI - Again, I was surprised to see him offered a new deal by the club. That said, he was good in patches last year. He doesn't do anything wrong, but he arguably lacks the size to be a modern day front rower. Like the majority of our 'props' last year, he is really a second rower who has been asked to put a shift in down the middle. The signs are that he will be asked to play in a similar role next season, but we need to see a bit more from him. Hopefully the pressure of being 'pack leader' will be taken off him and he can push on wherever he plays.

JONNY LOMAX - People have been saying for years that he isn't a 7, and thankfully a Saints coach finally agreed. Again, he missed a large portion of the season with injury but when he does play, he is constantly a threat, and constantly looks to take the line on. Granted, his defensive capabilities aren't in the same league as Paul Wellens, but the game has changed. Attacking from deep is crucial in the modern game and he offers us a yard of pace and threat out the back that we haven't had for years. He is by far a finished article but I'm sure that we have found the right position for him now and that he will develop and thrive upon it.

TOMMY MAKINSON - By all accounts he considers himself a Full-Back, but for me his future lies as a right winger. He's quick, confident enough take a man on down the short side, and his finishing capabilities are outstanding. Defensively he is solid and as I say, he is capable of scoring tries that he doesn't really have a right to score. He is still learning the game but he has huge potential.

WILLIE MANU - Been very much a hit and miss season for him. Good in patches, not so good in others. He is prone to throwing an unnecessary offload, and defensively he needs to improve. That said though, we started to see more of him as the season wore on. He started right run with a bit more aggression, hitting lines of Jon Wilkin and generally putting himself about. He was heavily criticised early doors, but as I say we started to see why he was so highly rated at Hull FC. Possibly our best player when we had everyone back fit. Needs a big year next year.

LOUIE McCARTHY-SCARSBROOK - Half way through the season I would have happily seen him on the first train back to London. A flat track bully who performs well against Salford at home, but fails to do it when it counts. His discipline was atrocious and he was making far to many handling errors. However, from the moment we beat Catalan he transformed into a different player, and that is down to the coach as well as the player himself. At 13 he has been playing brilliantly. Running great lines wider of the ruck, taking the ball in, making metres, defending well and working hard. If he can keep that up next season we have a great player on our hands. Finally showing why he was so highly rated down in the capital.

FRANCIS MELI -A player who has divided opinion throughout his time at the club, and will continue to do so at Salford I'm sure. People will remember his errors in the big games, his lapses of concentration, and also his individual warm up before the game. With ball in hand though he has been brilliant for us. His strike record is simply sensational. His form in the centre position during the second half of the season was simply outstanding, and before that as a winger, he was running the ball in hard and finishing brilliantly. To be honest, the feeling is that we have got shut of him to soon. He has a lot to offer if used correctly, and I wish him all the best at Salford.

GARETH O'BRIEN - The second loan signing brought in to assist an injury crisis and was a decent bit of business in a way. We needed a Half-Back, and the club managed to get just that. He brought a structure to our game when he did play, and his introduction appeared to give us an added boost of confidence. It would be been interesting to see where we would have found ourselves if we had kept him until the end of the season. His bravery deserved praising, but also shows that his passing technique needs to working on. He received consecutive head blows in games against Wigan and Catalan, but managed to get himself out on the field the next week. That takes some courage. I don't know where he will be next season, but we wish him all the best for the rest of his career.

MARK PERCIVAL- After some quality displays in the Under 20's, coupled with an eye catching performance in a win over Huddersfield in Pre-Season, he finally burst onto the scene against Leeds at LP. He is a genuine centre who has an eye for a gap, and has the rare ability to time a run off in order to find it. It's early days for him I know, but he looks to be the strike centre we have been looking for. His decision making needs working on, but he is talented player who I am looking forward to seeing next season. If he can keep himself fit we have a real gem.

JOSH PERRY - His time at Saints has finally come to a close, and its been a major disappointment. To be honest, I don't think he ever fully recovered from the leg injury he suffered in his final year at Manly. We never got to see the player who got the better of Jamie Peacock in that WCC, or the player who forced his way into the Australian test squad in his final year in the NRL. At least he finally managed to get his first try in Sants colours against Cas, but that was the last we saw of him. As I say though, I think he was doomed before he pulled on a redvee.

TONY PULETUA - Tony's Saints career was pretty much summed up in his final year at the club. We saw the occasional majestic offload, the odd barnstorming run on a sunny day, but that was backed up with poor performances when we needed him most. He's been a good servant for the club though, and if he is used correctly he will still do a job. I just feel as though is capable of so much more. He's been a good signing though, and leaves with the thanks of the club and fans.

JAMES ROBY - It's been a horrific year for him injury wise. The only positive is that he found some form towards the back end, and that would be an understatement. He was absolutely exceptional against Hull KR and Hull FC, and was brilliant against Australia last week on England duty. He is our best player by a country mile in my opinion, and when he wasn't on the field the effects were quite clear. He is quite simply world-class, and hopefully he is back to his best next season on the back of a quality forward pack.

SIA SOLIOLA -He didn't quite hit the heights of his previous season, but he has still been a valuable member of the squad throughout the year. Again though, he missed large portions through injury. After a slow start to the year he went back to what he does best; running hard, taking us forward, and leading by example. He misses the odd tackle, but that is something that can be coached out of him. Either way, he has been one of the few players over the past couple of years whose signing can genuinely be considered as a success.

ADAM SWIFT - For a young player who doesn't consider himself a specialist winger, his try scoring rate of over a try again on the left wing has been nothing short of sensational, especially considering he has played over 20 games. He's a great support player with a great knowledge and understanding of the game, and I can't see any reason why he won't be our first choice left winger next season. Really natural rugby player who is capable of playing pretty much anywhere in the back-line. If he can continue his work outside of Percival or Jones next season, we have a quality player on our hands.

LUKE THOMPSON - Luke is another talented young forward who has shown great promise in the games he has played in this season. Naturally he is still far from being the finished article but he carries the ball in strongly and puts himself about. He lead by example during a spell where few were prepared to do so. Again though, hopefully his progress will continue despite the players coming in in his position. If he continues to work hard he will force his way into the side, no doubt.

JORDAN TURNER - I know Sinkers disagrees, but the feeling is that he has done well this season. His Player of the Year award speaks for itself. He started poorly, but as the year progressed we started to see much more of him and why the club felt it was necessary to bring him in from Hull FC. He has certainly added a bit of pace to a desperately slow back-line of recent years. As I say, defensively he looked vulnerable early on but he has improved throughout the season. With Walsh in the side at 7, hopefully we will get to see him in a bit more space next season. He's done well this year.

ANTHONY WALKER - Not really sure what to make of him. Appears to be yet another workaholic who doesn't really have any 'X Factor' to his game. Doesn't let anyone down, but doesn't turn to many heads either. It will be difficult for him next season I suspect but we will see. Needs to find another dimension to his game if he is going to push on.

ALEX WALMSLEY - The success story of the season. Alex came to the club with a big reputation after his success at Batley, and it didn't take him long to show fans why. He runs with everything he has got every single time, and constantly drags defenders with him. He is a real platform layer for us and again, stood up for us when more experience forwards at the club were doing the opposite. He can certainly improve, certainly fitness wise, and he is prone to the odd error at the play-the-ball. Reminds me in some ways to James Graham's first season at the club. There could be worse comparisons for him.

PAUL WELLENS - The progression of Jonny Lomax has seen Paul switched from the role he has performed so well over the years. Whilst he is still solid defensively, the progression of the game means that a quicker more attacking Full-Back is vastly important going forward. 2013 has seen him fill at Full-Back, Stand-Off, Scrum-Half and even at Loose Forward. He finished the year coming off the bench at crucial periods of the game. Despite all this though, he has got on with the job in hand and never fails to give 100% to the cause. He literally sweats blood for the club wherever he is played. Without naming names, if others gave half as much passion and commitment as he gives we would be a whole lot better for it. He won't start next season but it's great to have a player like him at the club. A club legend and rightfully so.

JON WILKIN - Players player of the Year, and I don't think to many will disagree with that. He has been asked to play out side his comfort zone for a back-rower and has filled in at 6 or 7 for the majority of the year. He is far from a natural, but along with Wellens he has been the one leading by example and going the extra mile for the club. He kept us going when we looked as though we may just be falling apart and you can't ask for any more than that. He puts his body on the line for Saints and for that alone he receives everyone's thanks.

NATHAN BROWN - Everyone has different opinions of him, but it has certainly been difficult for him this season. On the negative side, he has been in charge during the worst run I can remember with 7 looses in 8 games, and although we have suffered horrendously through injuries, his squad rotation and team selections have left most people scratching their heads wondering what exactly he is doing. That said, we have progressed in certain areas. We now have Jonny Lomax playing regularly at Full-Back, LMS looking good at 13, he played Meli in his best position at centre, Swift on the wing, and has been part of making some quality signings for next year. All of which the majority of Saints fans have been calling for for years now. Despite all the team selections he found his best side by the end of the year, and we went into the Play-Offs arguably as the form side. We have foundations that we can build on now, and we look to playing more entertaining rugby that we have been under Simmons and Rush. The last few years have been transitional years for the club, but we appear to be on the right track now at last. We finally have a long term plan with attentions firmly focused on the playing side of things rather than the co-operate side. We have a great deal to be excited about with him at the helm. That's the feeling around the place anyway.
TLDR.
Pretty much agree with most of the analysis and sentiment there. Just a few things I'd like to moot:

Clough - I agree when you say he's been marginalised this season for being slightly too ordinary. I personally put that down to him being shoehorned into prop after starting so well as a second-row in his career. I think it's a wee bit tragic that he simply can't move back there now - his game and size don't suit that role any more and we've enough cover there as it is - and I think this could well be the last year we see him in a Saints jumper.

Jones - I think his future does lie in the left centre role. Yes, pace had always been his issue, but I think with his edge defence and safe if unspectacular hands, I think we'd have a left-sided Michael Shenton to utilise, and that's a good thing for me. Practically speaking, I think we may see him stay in the pack, though.

Laffranchi - completely disagree re: Laffranchi. Been an awesome pack leader in his two years at Saints, and while he's not the biggest, he's worth his weight in gold for the work he gets through, and can come up with a try too. I agree that his best position is not prop, but to say you're surprised he was offered a new deal is very harsh in my opinion.

Lomax - don't get me wrong, I'm glad he's at fullback. Said from the minute I saw him he was a natural fullback, but I think you're slightly off when saying he isn't a 7. He could be, but we haven't the nous to coach him in a way to make him a quality scrum-half; true of the British game all over really.

Meli - confusing guy, Francis. On the one hand you say we're getting rid at the wrong time. I can see where you're coming from in that sense, but conversely, I'd say that for completely different reasons, and say we should've got rid years ago. I believe you could get a return like his from a winger who won't cost you x amount of big games.

Turner - afraid I'm in Camp Sinkers with this one. That he got player of the year for us last term is the biggest indictment of our 2013 season. Thought he tried far too hard. There's a lot to work with there (and again, as far as coaching this goes, see under Lomax, Jonny) but there's certainly nothing natural there as far as creative centre play goes. Far too often the wrong decision was made in throwing a pass or taking on the line.

Wilkin - agree with the sentiment, but he simply cannot play at 6 for large spells next year.
Agree about Clough. I remember him bursting into the scene as a wide-running second-rower and being very effective. Then we started playing him at 13, and now obviously at prop. To be fair though, he was our top meter maker earlier in the year before having a spell out of the side. He's a decent squad player as he can play anywhere in the pack which makes him a useful bench spot. I just don't know how much inprovment he has left in him.

Jones. He'll do a job in the centre, certainly defensively, but if he is fit Percival has to start for me. In his brief spell in the side he showed more quality for me than a Saints left centre since Talau. He can beat a man one on one. He has an eye for a gap and has the pace to exploit it. Granted, his decision making needs working on but he is such a threat. Josh Jones is a decent player, but not half the centre Percival is IMO. He is exaclty what a centre should be for me. Can't stand this "shove a back-rower out there" idea we have in this country. Your centre should be one of the most creative players in the side. Jones' trouble as a centre is that he simply can pass a ball. As a back-rower he has great potential though. Runs hard, decent footwork, runs decent lines and is defensively solid. Won't start next season though IMO.

Laffranchi. I just think he again, would be so much more effective in the second-row. James Graham is and was world-class I know, but signing Boof wasn't even like for like. I think he would be a very good second-row, probably 13. He's a decent prop who has done well for us, but we constantly seemed to be out muscled by the better sides down the middle for 2 years since Jammer left. That's because we had one genuine prop in the squad, and that was Josh Perry. Thankfully we won't have that issue next year.
I think, conversely, if you put Jones in the back-row, you're guilty of putting a centre in the second-row. I don't think he's got the bulk to do that; not yet at least. And when you're playing with the likes of Soliola, Manu, Wilkin and Flanagan there, I don't see how he gets in. I think with him and Swift as a left-side combination there's a lot to go at, and, defensively, that combination would be very comfortable (they're great edge defenders and (to a lesser degree of significance) they played together at Brook). Percival should start, I agree, but I liked him as a right centre; giving us that traditional go-to option on that side of offence. It won't happen, because Turner got player of the year, so he's a cert to get one of the centre roles.
(11-03-2013 10:12 PM)Genghis Von Battenberg Wrote: [ -> ]Pretty much agree with most of the analysis and sentiment there. Just a few things I'd like to moot:









Turner - afraid I'm in Camp Sinkers with this one. That he got player of the year for us last term is the biggest indictment of our 2013 season. Thought he tried far too hard. There's a lot to work with there (and again, as far as coaching this goes, see under Lomax, Jonny) but there's certainly nothing natural there as far as creative centre play goes. Far too often the wrong decision was made in throwing a pass or taking on the line.

my main issue with him last season was..he went missing for large parts of the game. i know he's meant to play out wide but if you look at other teams many outside players run the ball up the pitch when the pack needs a breather i.e Charnley, Hall ect...

He just stood around literally waiting for something to happen rather than get involved and MAKE something happen. To me a good player is some one who will make something happen if there is nothing happening.

He knew as well as everyone else the the team last season wasn't at 100% but EVERYONE pulled together to try and make up for the loss of certain players..but he just stood there waiting.

Hope he can turn it around this season.
(11-07-2013 07:59 PM)sinkers89 Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-03-2013 10:12 PM)Genghis Von Battenberg Wrote: [ -> ]Pretty much agree with most of the analysis and sentiment there. Just a few things I'd like to moot:

Turner - afraid I'm in Camp Sinkers with this one. That he got player of the year for us last term is the biggest indictment of our 2013 season. Thought he tried far too hard. There's a lot to work with there (and again, as far as coaching this goes, see under Lomax, Jonny) but there's certainly nothing natural there as far as creative centre play goes. Far too often the wrong decision was made in throwing a pass or taking on the line.

my main issue with him last season was..he went missing for large parts of the game. i know he's meant to play out wide but if you look at other teams many outside players run the ball up the pitch when the pack needs a breather i.e Charnley, Hall ect...

He just stood around literally waiting for something to happen rather than get involved and MAKE something happen. To me a good player is some one who will make something happen if there is nothing happening.

He knew as well as everyone else the the team last season wasn't at 100% but EVERYONE pulled together to try and make up for the loss of certain players..but he just stood there waiting.

Hope he can turn it around this season.

As the old saying goes:

"There are three kinds of people in the world: those who make things happen, those who watch things happen and those who wonder what happened."

Saints need more makers and less watchers and wonderers.
(11-07-2013 08:05 PM)Genghis Von Battenberg Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-07-2013 07:59 PM)sinkers89 Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-03-2013 10:12 PM)Genghis Von Battenberg Wrote: [ -> ]Pretty much agree with most of the analysis and sentiment there. Just a few things I'd like to moot:

Turner - afraid I'm in Camp Sinkers with this one. That he got player of the year for us last term is the biggest indictment of our 2013 season. Thought he tried far too hard. There's a lot to work with there (and again, as far as coaching this goes, see under Lomax, Jonny) but there's certainly nothing natural there as far as creative centre play goes. Far too often the wrong decision was made in throwing a pass or taking on the line.

my main issue with him last season was..he went missing for large parts of the game. i know he's meant to play out wide but if you look at other teams many outside players run the ball up the pitch when the pack needs a breather i.e Charnley, Hall ect...

He just stood around literally waiting for something to happen rather than get involved and MAKE something happen. To me a good player is some one who will make something happen if there is nothing happening.

He knew as well as everyone else the the team last season wasn't at 100% but EVERYONE pulled together to try and make up for the loss of certain players..but he just stood there waiting.

Hope he can turn it around this season.

As the old saying goes:

"There are three kinds of people in the world: those who make things happen, those who watch things happen and those who wonder what happened."

Saints need more makers and less watchers and wonderers.

I thought it was dick's, pussy's and asshole's , CHUCK!
(11-07-2013 08:12 PM)sinkers89 Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-07-2013 08:05 PM)Genghis Von Battenberg Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-07-2013 07:59 PM)sinkers89 Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-03-2013 10:12 PM)Genghis Von Battenberg Wrote: [ -> ]Pretty much agree with most of the analysis and sentiment there. Just a few things I'd like to moot:

Turner - afraid I'm in Camp Sinkers with this one. That he got player of the year for us last term is the biggest indictment of our 2013 season. Thought he tried far too hard. There's a lot to work with there (and again, as far as coaching this goes, see under Lomax, Jonny) but there's certainly nothing natural there as far as creative centre play goes. Far too often the wrong decision was made in throwing a pass or taking on the line.

my main issue with him last season was..he went missing for large parts of the game. i know he's meant to play out wide but if you look at other teams many outside players run the ball up the pitch when the pack needs a breather i.e Charnley, Hall ect...

He just stood around literally waiting for something to happen rather than get involved and MAKE something happen. To me a good player is some one who will make something happen if there is nothing happening.

He knew as well as everyone else the the team last season wasn't at 100% but EVERYONE pulled together to try and make up for the loss of certain players..but he just stood there waiting.

Hope he can turn it around this season.

As the old saying goes:

"There are three kinds of people in the world: those who make things happen, those who watch things happen and those who wonder what happened."

Saints need more makers and less watchers and wonderers.

I thought it was dick's, pussy's and asshole's , CHUCK!

That too. More dick-makers, less pussy-watchers and a lot less asshole-wonderers, Chuck.
Just how did Jordan Turner get player of the year he is nothing special
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